FILED: NEW YORK COUNTY CLERK 04/17/ :01 PM INDEX NO /2016 NYSCEF DOC. NO RECEIVED NYSCEF: 04/17/2018

Transcription

1 1 1 SUPREME COURT OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK 2 COUNTY OF NEW YORK 3 4 In Re: NEW YORK CITY ASBESTOS LITIGATION 5 RICHARD S. TRUMBULL and MARGARET TRUMBULL 6 Index No / VOLUME I 11 Deposition Under 12 Oral Examination of RICHARD SCOTT TRUMBULL Job No. NJ

2 Mr. Trumbull, I think I know the answer to this 1 We' MR. ROMANELLI: re going to limit it 2 I' question, but I'll ask you, ve never been a 2 to what's in the W-2s. 3 smoker, correct? 3 MR. SCRUDATO: Wages. 4 A. That's correct. 4 MR. ROMANELLI: Right. 5 (Whereupon, the above-requested 5 MR. SCRUDATO: All right. That does 6 question and answer was then read by the 6 help streamline things a little bit. 7 7 reporter.) BY MR. SCRUDATO: 8 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 8 Q. Your -- 9 Q. Mr. Trumbull, you started at Franklin 9 A. Wages income Electric in 2002, correct? 10 MR. ROMANELLI: Wages A. Yes. 11 THE WITNESS: Business income I, I Q. Now, re aware that we have your ta 12 is not the same as passive income, right? They' we' 13 returns from 2005 through re not 13 MR. ROMANELLI: Well, re limiting 14 complete, but we have at least the 1040 form ai d 14 let's go off the record and just have a You' 15 maybe a few others. re aware of that? 15 discussion with him about what the elements are. 16 A. Yes. 16 MR. SCRUDATO: That would be a good 17 Q. We don't have your 2015 taxes yet. 17 idea. 18 Have they been prepared? 18 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record. The 19 A. I don't think -- I think we asked for 19 time is now 2:02 p.m. 2 0 an extension. 20 (Whereupon, a recess was then taken at 21 Q. Okay. Are you generally familiar with 21 2:03 p.m.) 22 your income stream over the course of the past 22 (Whereupon, proceedings resumed at 23 ten years or so? 23 2:06 p.m.) 24 A. Generally. 24 MR. ROMANELLI: Let's go back on the 2 5 Q. Okay.. Do you, do you record MR. SCRUDATO: Chris, do you have an 1 THE VIDEOGRAPHER. Back on the record 2 extra copy of his tax returns or he's going to 2 The time is now 2:05 p.m. 3 look at mine if he wants? 3 MR. ROMANELLI: Just a clarification of 4 MR. ROMANELLI: I don't have, I don't 4 We' my previous statement. re going to make a 5 have a hard copy. 5 claim for lost earnings which may or may not 6 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 6 income business income specifically; income from 7 Q. No problem. Your prin -- the principal 7 being a board member of certain boards. So 8 we' components of your income over that ten-year 8 that we'll be making a claim for, and you can 9 period, Mr. Trumbull, as you know, are wages an 1 9 definitely ask about it. 10 salaries and tips. That's one. The second will 10 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 11 be business income, and the third will be Q. Okay. Mr. Trumbull, the line items in 12 would be capital gains. Generally agree with 12 your federal income taxes that relate to 13 that? 13 business income over the course of the past ten 14 MR. ROMANELLI: Okay. Go ahead. You 14 years, can you tell us what work that income is 15 can answer that, but attributable to? 16 THE WITNESS: Yeah. 16 A. All right. I believe that those MR. ROMANELLI: We are going to make a 17 that line item refers to board fees, and I have 18 claim for lost wages. I don't think we can make 18 been, over that time frame, a director of 19 any capital gains claims, and I don't think we 19 various companies, and in that role, I, I'm paid 20 can make any claims for any passive income. So 20 in that role, and I think that income is 21 I don't know if that streamlines the process, 21 reflected on that line. 22 but this is stuff we can't make claims for. 22 Q. Okay. How many companies or entities 23 MR. SCRUDATO: Sure. Okay. So no 23 are you a member of the board for which you 24 claim for business income, no claim for capital 24 derive income? 25 gains. 25 A. Currently? (Pages 336 to 339)

3 Q. Yes. 1 A. That -- no, I believe that is 2 A. Four. 2 correct -- that is a complete list, yes. 3 Q. And what are those four? 3 Q. Okay. And you retired from the board 4 A. They're Welltower which is a New York 4 of directors of Franklin Electric in -- 5 Stock Exchange company; Columbus McKinnon 5 effective May, 2015, correct? 6 Corporation which is a NASDAQ company; the 6 A. Correct. 7 Artisan Mutual Fund Group which is a 1940 act 7 Q. All right. When did you cease serving 8 mutual fund business; and Schneider National 8 on the board of Calphalon? 9 which is a privately held logistics company. 9 A. Around around the year Q. And these are current board 10 Q. Okay. What is your yearly income fro 11 memberships? 11 the Welltower position? 12 A. Current board memberships. 12 A. A little over Q. When did you begin -- when did you 13 Q. And if it's got different components, 14 commence your work for Welltower on the board? 14 tell us. 15 A. I think it was A. I'm chairman of the audit committee of 16 Q. Okay. And how about Columbus McKinnon? 16 the company, and I get compensated -- additio1 al 17 A compensation for that, so I believe the total 18 Q. Artisan Funds? 18 compensation is a little over $200, A. Also around, around Q. Okay. How about Q. And how about Schneider? 20 A. Maybe 220. Something like that. 21 A Q. How about for Columbus McKinnon? 22 Q. Okay. And I take it ve been on the 22 A. I'm also chairman of the audit 23 boards of other companies. 23 committee of that company, and it's about 24 A. Welltower may have been 2000, but 24 $150,000 or -- yeah, 150 or so. 25 I'm -- somewhere at the end of the '90s or right 25 Q. Has the -- you mentioned that the at Welltower annual compensation for your service 2 Q. Have you, in the past, been on other 2 on the board is about $220, boards for which you were paid that you are no 3 A. I think so. 4 longer serving on? 4 Q. How long has it been at $220,000? 5 A. Yes. 5 A. A couple of years. 6 Q. And which would those have been? Is it 6 Q. Okay. And how about Columbus McKinnon?. 7 a long list? Before we start, I might want to 7 How long has it been at $150,000? 8 abbreviate this. 8 A. The same. 9 A. Not really. 9 Q. How about Artisan Funds? What is your 10 Q. -- Why 10 yearly compensation from Artisan Funds? 11 A. Franklin Electric; the Calphalon 11 A. About $260, company. I think that's it. 12 Q. And how long has it been at $260,000? we' 13 Q. Okay. So just so re clear, since 13 A. A couple of years , the only boards of directors you have 14 Q. Okay. And Schneider National, did you 15 served on for which you have derived income 15 call it? 16 would be Welltower, Columbia McKinnon A. Yeah. It's right around $200, A. Columbus McKinnon. 17 Q. Okay. And what was your yearly 18 Q. Columbus McKinnon, Artisan Funds, 18 compensation on the Franklin Electric board of 19 Schneider International, Franklin Electric, and 19 directors just for your board service? 2 0 Calphalon? 20 A. Okay. I only -- I was only a paid 21 A. Schneider National. 21 member of the board during the year that I 22 Q. Schneider National? 22 served as chairman of the board, but not CEO, 23 A. And -- yes. 23 and I believe I was paid around $300,000 to Q. Okay. No other paying board 24 for that role. 25 memberships of any kind since 2000? 25 Q. What year was that? 31 (Pages 340 to 343)

4 A. From May of 2014 to May of Q. Understood. 2 Q. And you retired as the Franklin 2 A. Other than the income I received as a 3 Electric CEO in May of 2014, correct? 3 board member. 4 A. Correct. 4 Q. Okay. The, the board member income, 5 Q. And you retired as a member of the 5 though, as I believe you testified a moment ago, 6 board of directors and chairman of the board in 6 would be reflected in the business income 7 April of 2015, effective May of 2015? 7 line -- 8 A. I can't remember whether it was 8 A. Yeah, that's -- 9 effective in April, but I know I retired in May 9 Q. -- of your 1040? 10 of A. Right. 11 Q. Okay. So you retired from all of your 11 Q. Okay. Now, in 2014, the line item for 12 positions at Franklin Electric prior to when 12 business income is about $1.1 million which 13 your -- prior to your diagnosis of mesotheliom2? 13 would appear to capture all of the cash that you 14 A. That's correct. 14 just told us about from your four board 15 Q. And your retirement from all of your 15 memberships. In 2013, it was $649,000, and the n 1 6 positions at Franklin Electric had nothing to do 16 in 2012, it was $433, with your subsequent diagnosis with 17 Given that your board income appears to 18 mesothelioma, correct? 18 have been flat for a couple of years, can you 19 A. That's correct. 19 give us some indication of how it went from Q. All right. In your tax returns, 20 in Mr. Trumbull, as we discussed earlier, there's a 21 A. Because in 2014, I went on two boards. 22 line item for wages and salaries and tips, 2 2 I didn't go on them on January 1st. 23 correct? Other than your Franklin Electric 23 Q. Okay. I'm sorry. I missed that. I 24 income, is there income from any other source 24 understand. So Columbus and Artisan you joint d 25 that you reported to the IRS as wages, salaries, 25 in 2014? and tips from 2005 to 2014 which are the only 1 A. Right. 2 records we have? 2 Q. That accounts for it. All right. In 3 MR. ROMANELLI: Hold on. Let me just , we don't have your tax return. 4 hear that question read back. 4 MR. ROMANELLI: Because it hasn't be:n 5 MR. SCRUDATO: Sure. 5 filed yet. 6 MR. ROMANELLI: Let me have it read 6 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 7 back. 7 Q. I know. But we do have your W-2, and 8 MR. SCRUDATO: I can clarify if you 8 that suggests that your -- that has a wages and 9 want. 9 salaries and tips line item of about 10 MR. ROMANELLI: Let me hear it first. 10 $7.1 million. Does that sound right to you. 11 (Whereupon, the above-requested 11 A. I think so, yeah. 12 question was then read by the reporter.) 12 Q. And that would be your last years of 13 THE WITNESS: Okay. 13 pay for your service as the CEO of Franklin 14 MR. ROMANELLI: That's fine. You can 14 Electric? 15 answer. 15 A. It includes -- well, it includes THE WITNESS: Yeah. I don't believe 16 MR. ROMANELLI: You can clarify it. 17 that we reported board income as wages, 17 THE WITNESS: It includes a lump sum 18 salaries, and tips. That -- so I think the only 18 pension benefit that I earned as CEO of Franklin 19 income that was in that category I believe was 19 that was -- that has paid out over time. So 20 my Franklin income. I didn't work for any other 20 there's a portion of that amount that is this 2 1 companies or derive salary from any other 21 lump sum pension benefit that's paid, yeah. 22 companies during that time frame BY MR. SCRUDATO: 23 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 23 Q. Partly included in that 2015 W-2? 2 4 Q. Okay. 24 A. Yeah. 25 A. -- other than on -- as a board member. 2 5 Q. Okay. I understand. Understood. So 32 (Pages 344 to 347)

5 your attorney mentioned that re making a 1 road trip with your wife and the dog. 2 claim for lost wages as part of your lawsuit. 2 A. We just got in the car and headed west. 3 Can you articulate for us what your lost wage 3 Q. And where did you end up? 4 claim is? 4 A. Well, we, we went -- we just kind of 5 A. Yeah. When I left Owens Illinois, I 5 slowly wove our way through the Midwest and the 6 retired from Owens Illinois and went to work fo 6 into Colorado and then out ultimately into 7 Franklin Electric. And when I retired from 7 Idaho. And our sons, as part of this trip, had 8 Franklin Electric, it was my plan and 8 given us a stay at supposedly the number-one fly 9 expectation to become CEO of another company.. 9 fishing resort on one of the rivers in, in 10 Q. I understand. Did you -- when you 10 Idaho, and we stayed there for a week or so and 11 retired from Franklin Electric, had you taken 11 then kind of wound our way back. 12 any measures that you can explain to us in 12 Q. Back to Toledo? 13 furtherance of your plan to become CEO of 13 A. Back to Toledo, right. 14 another company? 14 Q. That was a two-month trip, you said? 15 A. At -- not until after I retired as CEO 15 A. Yeah. 16 of -- and chairman of Franklin. 16 Q. Okay. When did you have the 17 Q. That's what I'm trying to get at. Let 17 tentative -- did you say it was two 18 me ask a slightly more precise question then. 18 conversations or one, and if -- I don' don't 19 From the time that you retired from your CEO 19 recall position in -- from Franklin Electric in May, in 20 A. I, I May of 2014 to the time that you were diagnosed 21 MR. ROMANELLI: Object to form. I 2 2 with mesothelioma in September of 2015, had you 22 don't think he said. 23 taken any affirmative steps that you can 23 THE WITNESS: Probably several 2 4 articulate for us in furtherance of your plan to 2 4 conversations. 25 become a CEO of another company? 25 BY MR. SCRUDATO: MR. ROMANELLI: Hold on one second. 1 Q. Okay. When did you have the 2 Let me have the question read back. 2 conversations with this entity that matches CEO 3 (Whereupon, the above-requested 3 candidates with private equity firms? 4 question was then read by the reporter.) 4 A. I think he first contacted me around 5 MR. ROMANELLI: Object to form, but ycu 5 the time that my retirement was announced, an 1 I 6 can answer it if you follow it. 6 believe that we announced that I would be 7 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 7 retiring, you know, several months before I 8 Q. Do you understand my question? 8 actually retired. 9 A. Yeah, I understand it clearly. I -- 9 Q. So would that have been about March of 10 after I retired in May, my wife and I took a ? 11 road trip, and we were gone for a couple of 11 A. I think so. 12 months. 12 Q. Who, who, who was this person who 13 Q. You know what I'm going to ask about 13 contacted you? 14 the road trip next. 14 A. A guy named Arness Kims. 15 MR. ROMANELLI: Let him finish his 15 Q. And where does Arness work? 16 answer first, please. 16 A. I'm not sure. I think it's Chicago. 17 THE WITNESS: And we took the dog. Ard 17 Q. Do you know the name of the company. 18 I had had -- I would call them tentative 18 MR. ROMANELLI: Object to form. 19 conversations with a firm that matches CEOs 19 THE WITNESS: I don't recall the name 20 with -- or potential -- CEOs with private equity 20 of the company. 21 firms, but I had not really started a campaign 21 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 22 to seek another job at that, at that point. And 22 Q. Okay. Did you talk to Arness after you 23 then in September I got this diagnosis. 23 formally retired from Franklin Electric in May, 24 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 24 in May of 2014? 25 Q. Okay. So tell me about the two-month 25 A. Yes. 33 (Pages 348 to 351)

6 Q. You mentioned that you spoke to him a 1 prepared to start this process to contact 2 few times in or about March of 2014 when your 2 several of the executive recruiters that I had 3 retirement was announced. 3 used over the years at Franklin Electric and let 4 A. I think that's when he -- I believe 4 them know I'm back in the market and I'm, you 5 that's when he contacted me, but I'm not, I'm 5 know, interested in an opportunity and would 6 not certain of the exact date. 6 they please, you know, go to work for me. 7 Q. Understood. But it was in about March 7 Q. Understood. In or about March of of 2014? 8 when you talked to Mr. Kims, did you send hi 9 A. Yeah. 9 anything or did he send you anything in 10 Q. And you -- I don't want to put words 10 furtherance of these conversations? 11 into your mouth, but was it two conversations 11 A. He has continued to send me informatio 1 12 that you had with Arness in March about his company and the approach he uses to 13 A. Probably -- oh, in March. 13 match executives with private equity firms. 14 Q. Yeah. Was it two conversations you had 14 Q. Okay. After you retired from Franklin 15 with Arness in March of 2014? 15 Electric in May of 2014, did you talk to Arness?. 16 MR. ROMANELLI: He said several. 16 A. I -- yes, I have spoken with him 17 THE WITNESS: That's -- I said I don't 17 subsequent to that. 18 know whether it was March of He contact d 18 Q. Okay. On how many occasions? 19 me, I believe, before I had retired, and he 19 A. Once or twice, I would say. 20 contacted me after I retired. 2 0 Q. And would that have been prior to the 21 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 21 time you were diagnosed with mesothelioma? 22 Q. Okay. 22 A. Yes. 23 A. And, and, and -- but I don't recall 23 Q. From your retirement from Franklin 24 the -- he' precisely the dates, and then he's 24 Electric in May of 2014 through September of 25 contacted me on other occasions by , had you ever met with Arness? 1 Q. Okay. Do you recall how -- when you 1 A. No talked to Arness in March of 2014, can you tell 2 Q. Okay. During that time period, did you 3 me how long those conversations were? 3 meet with any other recruiter in furtherance of 4 A. Okay. The answer -- the precise answer 4 your plan for a subsequent CEO position or a 5 to your question is I don't recall precisely how 5 subsequent position with a private equity firm? 6 long they are. I thought -- he and I probably 6 MR. ROMANELLI: Object to form. 7 had about a half hour conversation at one point 7 THE WITNESS: I wasn't necessarily 8 Q. Okay. And would have been -- would 8 seeking out a private equity firm. My plan was 9 that half an hour conversation have taken place 9 not necessarily to seek out a private equity 10 in March of 2014? 10 firm. 11 A. It would have taken place sometime I 11 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 12 believe around then, but I'm Q. Okay. 13 Q. Okay. 13 A. It would have been -- it could have 14 A. I don't know precisely, again, as I 14 been another public company. It could have beet 15 said, when a private company. It could have been a private 16 Q. Understood. 16 equity owned company. wasn' 17 A. -- the guy called. 17 So I didn't have a -- I wasn't 18 Q. Did you, did you meet Mr. Kims in March 18 specifically seeking that type of business, but 19 of 2014? 19 having said that, I did not talk -- between May 20 A. No. 20 when I left Franklin, May of 2015 and Septembe1 21 Q. So it was just a phone call? Just a 21 of 2015 when I was diagnosed, I had not spoken 22 few phone calls? 22 with Arness Kims or any other head hunter at 23 A. Yeah. He contacted me. This -- you 23 that point. 24 know, my plan for seeking out another executi e 24 Q. Okay. I'm not sure I'm following. 25 role would -- was to -- at the time that I was 2 5 MR. ROMANELLI: Let me have the answ:r 34 (Pages 352 to 355)

7 read back. 1 diagnosis, has been in excellent physical 2 (Whereupon, the above-requested answer 2 condition and was fully capable of continuing t3 3 was then read by the reporter.) 3 work and desirous of continuing to work. 4 You' MR. ROMANELLI: You've said May 2014 a 4 Q. Okay. 5 couple of times, but it's clear it's a matter of 5 A. So that, that -- now, did Arness 6 public record when he retired. 6 contact me again in that period? And did I hav 7 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 7 a conversation with him? I don't know. I, I, I 8 Q. Well, there's two retirements. You 8 really don't recall, but he wasn't my primary 9 retired from Franklin Electric -- from your CEO 9 strategy for finding my next job. 10 position at Franklin Electric in May of 2014? 10 It just -- this is something that kind 11 A. Correct. 11 of came in over the transom, but I was 12 Q. And you retired from your board of 12 responding to your question did I have any 13 directors position in Franklin Electric in May 13 discussions with him or discussions with any, 14 of 2015? 14 anybody that pertained to future employment. 15 A. Right. 15 Q. Fair enough. I understand. Did you Q. All right. So if I understand your 16 did you age out at Franklin Electric? Did they 17 testimony, between May of 2014 and September of 17 have some sort of mandatory retirement policy or , you did not talk to Arness or any other 18 did you just choose to retire? 19 recruiter in furtherance of your plan for a 19 A. I chose to retire. 20 subsequent position; is that correct? 20 Q. And so why? 21 A. No, that is not correct. 21 A. The reason I left Owens Illinois was 22 Q. Okay. 2 2 that the CEO wouldn't retire, and, and, and I 23 A. Arness, Arness contacted me, and I'm 23 don't know what his motivation was or what, bat 24 quite sure he initially contacted me before I 2 4 it had the effect of causing me to believe, to 25 retired as CEO of Franklin. 25 believe that maybe 1 Q. Correct. 1 the company. my best strategy was to leave A. And I believe -- and my belief is just 2 And at Franklin, we were very 3 based on the fact that I don't think he would 3 successful. Our stock price went up a lot, and 4 contact me while I was still CEO, that I believe 4 we did, we did some really good things, and I 5 that initial contact was probably triggered by 5 didn't do that alone. I had a team of people 6 the announcement of my upcoming retirement. Anc 6 that worked with me, most of which were young er 7 he sent me information on the way that he 7 than I was, and if they were going to have their 8 matches up CEOs, and I was interested in hearing 8 opportunity to run the company, if I stayed on, 9 him out, so I had a conversation that may have 9 then it would, it would have made it difficult 10 lasted a half hour or so with him sometime after 10 because they would start to age out, and I 11 I retired as CEO. 11 didn't want to be that guy. 12 It was not my plan to find another job, 12 And so I -- you know, I'd had my run, 13 however, after I retired as CEO while I was 13 and we were very successful, and I wanted the 14 still chairman of the company. So I, I wasn't 14 guys that had helped make that, you know, 15 seeking additional employment or anything during 15 success occur to have their opportunity. So I 16 that period. I was still chairman of the 16 left the company and turned it over to, to them, 17 company, involved with the business and the 17 and stayed on for a year to kind of keep an eye 18 management team. 18 on things and, you know, I'm still involved with 19 When I retired as chairman of Franklin, 19 the team, but not an insider anymore, and -- but 20 my plan was to take some time off with -- you 2 0 that's why I left the company. 21 know, do some stuff with my wife, have a summer 21 Q. So it was all part of, in your view, 22 with my family, and then start the process of 2 2 responsible succession planning? 23 seeking employment -- additional employment. 23 A. Yes. 24 Keep myself active. 24 Q. Who ended up becoming the CEO? 25 I'm a person that, up until this 25 A. Gregg Sengstack. 35 (Pages 356 to 359)

8 Q. And was Gregg employed at Franklin 1 Q. Is there any other income? 2 Electric prior to when he became CEO? 2 A. Unearned income. 3 A. Oh, yeah. 3 Q. Well, correct. But re not -- 4 Q. So he was one of the members of your 4 there's no lost wage -- We' 5 team? 5 MR. ROMANELLI: re not -- 6 A. Absolutely. 6 THE WITNESS: Right. 7 Q. All right. So I think I understand now 7 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 8 the contacts with Arness Kims. You talked to 8 Q. So just so we have a clean question and 9 him for 30 minutes or so in March or so of 2014, 9 answer, the only earned income you have since 10 correct? 10 you retired from Franklin Electric is the income 11 A. Right. 11 you derive from service on the four boards of 12 Q. You did not take any further steps in 12 directors you told us about a few moments ago 13 furtherance of your plan for a subsequent 13 A. Yes. 14 position while you remained at Franklin Electri; 14 Q. All right. Your wife is your only 15 through May of 2015, correct? 15 dependent? 16 A. Correct. 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Because you were still at the company? 17 Q. Other than your -- I'm not asking you 18 A. Right. 18 about any conversations with a lawyer. Okay? 19 Q. All right. During the period May of 19 Have you talked to anyone about your right to to September of 2015, when you were 2 Workers' 0 seek any Compensation benefits fro 2 1 diagnosed, did you take any affirmative steps it. 21 Owens Illinois other than your lawyer? 22 furtherance of your plan during that time 22 MR. ROMANELLI: Other than your 23 period? 23 lawyers. 24 A. No, I did not. 24 MR. SCRUDATO: That's what I just said Q. Okay.. Since you were diagnosed with 25 MR. ROMANELLI: Plural mesothelioma, have you taken any steps in 1 THE WITNESS: No. 2 furtherance of your plan for a subsequent 2 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 3 position? 3 Q. Are you aware that you are free to seek 4 A. No. 4 Workers' Compensation benefits from Owens 5 MR. ROMANELLI: You can explain your 5 Illinois in connection with your mesothelioma? 6 answer, of course. 6 MR. ROMANELLI: Objection. Answer that 7 THE WITNESS: I mean, I mean, the 7 yes or no only. 8 reality is I have a disease that's likely to 8 THE WITNESS: Am I aware? No. 9 kill me, and, you know, I'm not going to become 9 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 10 CEO of a company and pull the wool over their 10 Q. Are you aware that your spouse is also 11 eyes. In a public company, that would be 11 entitled to Workers' Compensation benefits from 12 illegal, and, you know, its at least immoral. 12 Owens Illinois in connection with her -- in 13 And it's also -- it' it' I mean, it's, it's 13 connection with your mesothelioma for the 14 kind of at this point public knowledge that I 14 duration of her life? Are you aware of that? 15 have a disease that most of the time -- most all 15 MR. ROMANELLI: Answer that yes or no 16 the time ends up with a not so happy ending. 1 6 only. 17 And that is not the strongest platform for 17 THE WITNESS: No. 18 seeking future employment. 18 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 19 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 19 Q. Do you have any understanding of what 20 Q. Okay. So since you retired from 20 those benefits to either you or your wife would 2 1 Franklin Electric in May of 2015, your 21 only be from Owens Illinois in connection with your 22 income has been the income you derive from 22 mesothelioma? 23 service on the four boards of directors you told 23 A. No. 24 us about a few minutes ago? 24 Q. Okay. 25 A. Right. My only earned income. 25 MR. ROMANELLI: Let me also just put an 36 (Pages 360 to 363)

9 objection to this line of questioning. 1 A. Yes. 2 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 2 Q. Okay. So I take it ve been able to 3 Q. Well, I'm done, but feel free. 3 maintain your appetite? 4 MR. ROMANELLI: Yeah, but just for the 4 A. Yes. 5 record, an objection to the line of questioning 5 Q. And I know from reading your medical 6 because it calls for a legal conclusion, and it 6 records that you go out to eat a lot. 7 sounds like ve reached a conclusion that 7 may A. We have -- when we lived in New York, I' 8 be different from the conclusion I've reached, 8 we ate out almost every dinner. 9 so -- 9 MR. ROMANELLI: Like every New Yorker; 10 MR. SCRUDATO: Okay. 10 Manhattanite, anyway. 11 MR. ROMANELLI: -- but re entitle 11 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 12 to ask those questions, so Q. And when you are in Toledo, do you go 13 BY MR. SCRUDATO: 13 out a lot? 14 Q. Mr. Trumbull, when -- when are you 14 A. We, we go out regularly. 15 going back to Sloan-Kettering for further 15 Q. With friends? 16 treatment? I thought it's in June at some 16 A. Yup. 17 point. 17 Q. Have you been able to continue to do 18 A. Yes. 18 that in the past three or four months? 19 Q. And how long do you expect tobe back 19 A. Yes. 2 0 for that treatment? 20 Q. Again, I know from your medical records 21 A. It depends on the results of -- I'm 21 that you exercise a lot. 22 going back for a scan A. That is correct. 23 Q. Okay. 2 3 Q. Have you been able to keep up your 24 A. -- to see whether at this stage I have 24 exercise? 2 5 evidence of the disease or not. If I do, I 25 A. Yes. Wait. I better clarify that could be there for a while depending upon wha 1 Exercise for me before I went through all this 2 we decide is the next step. And if I don't, 2 was running 30 miles a week and lifting weigh s 3 then I would come back to the Midwest 3 and that sort of thing. Exercise for me now is 4 immediately and then go back again for the nex t 4 walking with my wife. 5 scan in 90 days. 5 Q. Okay. 6 Q. So how do you feel today or lately? 6 A. But I do -- I move -- I will continue 7 A. Not normal, but I'm very thankful for 7 to move as long as I possibly can. 8 the treatment I got at Sloan. 8 Q. Are you unable to run now? 9 Q. When you say not normal, can you 9 A. I'm unable to run. 10 elaborate on that for us? 10 Q. Is it because of tiredness or something 11 MR. ROMANELLI: What re? feeling 11 else? 12 THE WITNESS: I do not have as much 12 A. They removed the pleura or chunks of 13 energy as I had at one point. I have a the pleura of my chest cavity, and that sort of 14 continue to have a side effect from the surgery 14 keeps your organs, I'm told, together. And 15 that makes half of my chest cavity numb, but, 15 running is pretty jarring, and it bothers me 16 you know, some, some days there's -- they had o 16 when I run at this point. 17 cut through a bunch of nerves and what have you 17 Q. Okay. 18 that are starting to re-generate, and in the 18 A. Or when I try to run. And I also just 19 course of that, I get -- I have fairly sharp 19 don't have the -- as much energy as I did, 20 pains from time to time through my chest cavit. 20 but That sort of thing. 21 Q. Have you been BY MR. SCRUDATO: 22 A. -- but I can walk miles and miles, and 23 Q. Okay. It's June now. Since -- in the 23 I try to do that every day. 24 past three or four months, have you been able to 24 Q. With your wife? 2 5 maintain your weight? 25 A. With my wife. 37 (Pages 364 to 367)

10 Counsel. 1 have had would have been in conflict with 2 MR. ROMANELLI: Let's take a lunch 2 Franklin. And so I really wasn't interested in 3 break and come back at 2: in pursuing those strategies or even, you 4 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are now off the 4 know, communicating them with him. And so I 5 record at 1:26 p.m. 5 basically kind of was pushing him off in terms 6 (Whereupon, a recess was then taken.) 6 of dealing with him. But I think the question 7 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are now back o 1 7 was asked me had anybody -- had I talked to 8 the record. The time is 2:38 p.m. 8 anybody about my career plans and that sort of 9 9 thing. So I had spoken with him and I was kind 10 EXAMINATION BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 10 of pushing him off Q. Okay. Thank you. Then -- I know 12 Q. Good afternoon, Mr. Trumbull. 12 Owens-Corning Fiberglass owned a company name 13 A. Good afternoon. 13 Trumbull Asphalt. Is that any connection to 14 Q. My name is Dan Gagliardi from Lynch 1 4 you? 15 Daskal & Emery. Did you have a good lunch? 15 A. No connection. 16 A. Yes, yes. Too much food. 16 MS. BURSHTYN: One second. Could you 17 Q. Just a couple of random questions 17 speak up a little bit for me? 18 first. Mr. Arnes Kins (sic), you spoke about 18 MR. GAGLIARDI: Sure. 19 him I believe on the second day of your 19 MS. BURSHTYN: Thank you. 20 deposition. Do you recall the name of the firm 20 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 21 that he worked for? 21 Q. When your father -- among his friends 22 A. I don' don't. 22 and colleagues, was he generally known as Dick 23 Q. Was it Cook M & A Advisory Services? 2 3 or Richard? 24 A. Could have been. Oh, I don't know if 24 A. Yes, Dick. 25 that's it. I'm familiar with that name, but I 25 Q. Did he go by any other nicknames? don't recall whether he worked for that firm or 1 A. Not that I know of. 2 not. 2 Q. Do you know was your father ever 3 MR. ROMANELLI: It looks to me like 3 deposed in asbestos litigation as a witness or 4 he's in a different line of work now. 4 representative of OCF? 5 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 5 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 6 Q. Okay. Did he approach you about a 6 THE WITNESS: Not that I know of. 7 program called CEO Visions? 7 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 8 A. Yes. 8 Q. Do you know did he have any involvem mt 9 Q. Okay. And did you have a target 9 in OCF's asbestos litigation? 10 acquisition in mind when you spoke with 10 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 11 Mr. Kins? 11 THE WITNESS: Okay. My dad died in 12 A. He first contacted me, as I recall, And, I don't know, there may have been 13 when my retirement from Franklin Electric was 13 asbestos litigation prior to that, there 14 announced and the way -- I didn't contact him. 14 probably was, but I don't remember him ever 15 And as I indicated, my strategy for finding 15 talking about it or being involved in it at all. 1 6 future employment didn't involve necessarily 1 6 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 17 working with him, but he did contact me about 17 Q. Again, its just what you know. We 18 his job is to match CEOs with ideas about 18 don't need you to guess or anything. 19 building companies with private equity firms whol 9 A. Yes. 20 would back them in that endeavor, you know, and2 0 Q. Thank you. And among your friends an 1 21 usually they would be some kind of roll-up 21 colleagues, are you generally known as Richard 2 2 strategy. 22 or Scott? 23 And at the time I had just spent A. Scott. 24 years or 13 years running a company -- Frankli 1 24 Q. So if we were to speak witha 25 Electric, and many of the best ideas I would 25 co-worker, we would generally say "Scott 44 (Pages 1245 to 1248)

11 1 Trumbull" as having -- knowing you? 1 MR. ROMANELLI: Never mind. 2 A. Yes. 2 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 3 Q. I notice you have investments in two 3 Q. Would it have been in the '60s or '70s? 4 companies called AEMFF, LLC and AEBPFF, LLC.. 4 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 5 Are those oil and gas exploration companies? 5 THE WITNESS: No. 6 A. Yes. 6 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 7 Q. Okay. Did you ever go on site where 7 Q. Do you believe you came into contact 8 they were drilling oil wells or visit the 8 with any asbestos at all when you were visiting 9 facilities? 9 the Whirlpool facilities or factories? 10 MR. ROMANELLI: At any time? 10 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 11 THE WITNESS: For those guys? 11 THE WITNESS: No. 12 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 12 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 13 Q. At any time. Were you ever at a gas 13 Q. And then in the medical records from 1 4 site, oil site? I noticed that it had stated that you were 15 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 15 living apart from your wife. Were you separat d 16 THE WITNESS: I believe so. I don' don't 16 or was that you were just living in separate 17 have a specific recollection of being on site, 17 residences? 18 I' but I can recall that I've been on -- at an oil 18 MR. ROMANELLI: Hold on a second. 19 and gas -- oil and/or gas object to the form of your question. Your use 20 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 2 0 of the word "separated", you mean legally 21 Q. Do you know when that would have been? 21 separated or physically separated because of 22 A. No. 22 work? 23 Q. Was it -- could you say it was in the 23 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 2 4 last 15 years, in the '80s, in the '70s, 24 Q. Were you having a separation in your 25 anything like that? 25 marriage or were you just living in different 1 A. Probably the last 15 years. 1 residences? Q. Do you know if you came into contact 2 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 3 with any asbestos when you were visiting those 3 THE WITNESS: Neither. 4 sites? 4 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 5 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 5 Q. Okay. 6 MR. ROMANELLI: 15 years? 6 A. When I became Franklin Electric it was 7 THE WITNESS: I don't -- if I had, I 7 headquartered in Fort Wayne. I had lived for 30 8 wouldn't have gone. If I had been aware of it, 8 years in Toledo. It's about an hour and 40 9 I wouldn't have gone. 9 minute car ride from one city to the other. My 10 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 10 wife is very involved in institutions in Toledo, 11 Q. Okay. Did your -- did your wife's 11 and since I was traveling almost all the time as 12 family found Whirlpool, the appliance 12 CEO, especially during the early years with 13 manufacturer? 13 Franklin, we got a home in Fort Wayne and for n e 14 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 14 to stay in when I was there. And if I were not 15 THE WITNESS: Yes. 15 going to be traveling for a week, she would come 16 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 16 over with the dog and we would be together but 17 Q. Have you ever visited any Whirlpool 17 if I was going to be gone anyway, she would 18 factories or manufacturing facilities? 18 rather be alone in Toledo than alone in Fort 19 MS. BURSHTYN: Objection. 19 Wayne. So we kept our house in Toledo and kind 20 THE WITNESS: Yes. 20 of structured our life that way during the 21 BY MR. GAGLIARDI: 21 period of time. And then every weekend I was 22 Q. When was that? 22 home with her, either in Fort Wayne or Toledo. 23 MR. ROMANELLI: Let me belatedly object 23 So that's the way we structured our lives during 24 to the form of your question. Go ahead that period of my career. 25 THE WITNESS: I don't recall. 25 MR. ROMANELLI: Sort of like everybod3 45 (Pages 1249 to 1252)

12 DEFENSE COUNSEL: Objection. 1 businesses where I had had previous experience 2 Speculation, foundation, calls for expert 2 Q. And what size organizations are we 3 opinion. 3 talking about? 4 DEFENSE COUNSEL: Asked and answered. 4 A. Oh, half a billion dollars or more. 5 BY MS. BURSHTYN: 5 Q. What role would you have been seeking? 6 Q. Does that include exposures that ve 6 A. CEO. 7 mentioned as a child, through your home 7 Q. What types of organizations are you 8 renovations, working in various positions for 8 talking about? 9 Owens-Illinois and also at the Libbey plant? 9 A. Oh, public companies, large private 10 A. Yes. 10 companies, companies with perhaps private equ ty 11 DEFENSE COUNSEL: Same objections. 11 backing. 12 Overbroad, vague, compound. 12 Q. How had you planned to seek employme1 t 13 BY MS. BURSHTYN: 13 from these types of organizations or companies 14 Q. Did you have your -- did you have an 14 A. A combination of contacting recruiting 15 opportunity to tell your doctor about those 15 firms that I had had experience with over the 16 exposures? 16 course of my career and knew me and networkir g 17 A. The one time that I discussed with my 17 with board colleagues and other people that I 18 doctor or doctors any exposure that I had with 18 knew who had vast connections throughout 19 asbestos was at the meeting with my doctor where 19 industry. 20 they told me I had mesothelioma and asked me if 20 Q. And have you done any of that 21 I -- over the course of your lifetime, have you 21 networking or reaching out to head hunters to 2 2 ever been around asbestos. 22 date? 23 And I, at that moment, was in, in no A. No. 2 4 I didn't try to review my entire career and give 2 4 Q. Why not? 25 a comprehensive list. I just blurted out the 25 A. I retired in May of My plan was first thing that came to mind which was yes, I 1 to take the, the summer, travel with my wife, 2 worked around asbestos when I was a student. 2 spend time with my -- other members -- my kid, 3 Q. How were you feeling when they told ycu 3 and then start a job campaign in the fall. On 4 that you had mesothelioma? 4 September 24th of 2015, my birthday, by the wey, 5 A. I was shocked and disappointed. 5 I was diagnosed with mesothelioma. 6 Q. As a result of developing mesothelioma, 6 Q. And how did that impact your job 7 are you now unable to work in the same way that 7 search? 8 ve done before? 8 A. This disease is normally fatal within a 9 DEFENSE COUNSEL: Objection. 9 period of time -- short period of time, and it's 10 THE WITNESS: Yes. 10 difficult for me to approach potential employers 11 BY MS. BURSHTYN: 11 with that kind of cloud hanging over my head. 12 Q. You had retired from Owens-Illinois, 12 Q. Why would you anticipate that they 13 and you had moved on to Franklin Electric; is 13 would not be interested in hiring you because of 14 that correct? 14 this disease? 15 A. Yes. 15 A. Well, anybody that would be hiring me 1 6 Q. And then in May of 2015, you retired as 1 6 has a fiduciary responsibility for the, for the 17 the chairman of Franklin Electric, correct. 17 company that they are hiring me for, and it 18 A. Yes. 18 would not be prudent or appropriate for them to 19 Q. After retiring from Franklin Electric, 19 hire somebody with that much risk of having a 2 0 had you intended to seek further employment? 20 very short tenure getting things started and 21 A. Yes. 21 then not being able to finish them. 22 Q. What companies or industries had you 22 Q. Thank you, sir. I want to move back a 23 planned to target? 23 minute and talk about the types of safety 24 A. I planned to look at manufacturing 2 4 measures that you have taken over the course of 25 companies, logistics companies, those types of 25 your career, okay. When you went on job sites, 27 (Pages 1935 to 1938)