Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que - Holly Hill, SC *** Date: June 14, 2012 Location: Sweatman s Bar-B-Que - Holly Hill, SC Interviewer: Rien Fertel

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1 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que - Holly Hill, SC *** Date: June 14, 2012 Location: Sweatman s Bar-B-Que - Holly Hill, SC Interviewer: Rien Fertel Transcription: Shelley Chance, ProDocs Length: 39 minutes Project: Southern BBQ Trail - South Carolina

2 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 2 [Begin Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que] 00:00:05 Rien Fertel: All right; this is Rien Fertel with the Southern Foodways Alliance, continuing on the South Carolina Southern BBQ Trail. I m at Sweatman s Bar-B-Que and it is Thursday, June 14, a quarter to nine o'clock at night. And we just saw some hogs being fired. We re sitting just inside the pit room and I m going to have the gentleman who fired those hogs introduce himself. Douglas Oliver: My name is Douglas Oliver. 00:00:38 RF: And your birth date, please? 00:00:41 DO: [April 1, 1961]. 00:00:43 RF: All right; now Mr. Douglas how long have you worked here at Sweatman s? 00:00:44 DO: I ve worked here I d say thirty-five years. 00:00:50

3 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 3 RF: And so, when did you start and why did you start? What was your position? 00:00:53 00:00:59 DO: Well, I started as a meat cutter and I graduated to the cook. And we started I started here I d say roughly the 1980s, something like that there. During that time we was real busy, real, real busy, a bunch of hogs thirty-five a week. For some reason or another now, you know, the economy got us and we slowed down but we still got good business. RF: Where did you grow up? 00:01:32 00:01:33 DO: Well, I grew up not far from here, about two two and a half miles down the road. I was born and raised right down there. RF: What s the name of the community or the town? 00:01:42 00:01:42 DO: Uh, it s Holly Hill is the town but it s where I was born and raised it s the name of it was Connor Station Farm and that s where I grew up at. I lived there until I was about say fourteen and then the family moved to Eutawville.

4 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 4 00:02:00 RF: And how far is that? 00:02:04 DO: That s about another three and a half miles from here. 00:02:06 RF: What did your family do? 00:02:09 DO: My father was a farmer and my mother was a housewife. We just like thirteen head of us so as they grew older they moved out and I m the baby of the family. I m number thirteen. RF: So you had twelve other siblings? 00:02:26 DO: Yes; yes. 00:02:27 RF: And who who did the cooking in your family? 00:02:31 DO: My mother and my sisters; basically my mother. She was one of the old-timers. 00:02:33

5 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 5 RF: What do you remember about what she cooked and what was your favorite? 00:02:40 00:02:44 DO: A lot; being a good God-fearing woman she was, basically anything she would cook I would eat. And like I say she would she d cook for the whole family. She d get up she d get up 5:30 six o'clock in the morning. My dad, he had to have his breakfast before he d go to work. And she d have it it was so hot she would have to put it in the window like a pie, you know, to cool it off then; yeah. My mother, she she kind of like held the family together. 00:03:17 RF: And so you started working here in the early- 80s. Did you have any cooking or barbecue experience before that? 00:03:25 DO: No, not not much. Basically like I told you there was this old man that used to work here when I got here. His name was Chalmon Smalls and he basically taught me everything I know. And right now he s come of age and he got a little his health failed a little bit, and then, you know, he just decided, you know, to just turn the reins over to me. so I stepped in when he stepped out and I been doing it ever since. RF: Tell us more about Mr. Smalls. Is he still around? Is he still alive? 00:03:54

6 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 6 00:03:57 DO: Yeah; he s still living and like I say, he was a God-fearing man and like I say he taught me everything I know and basically anybody that came through here and worked here know him, you know. He was a good guy, real nice gentleman. Like I say, he taught me everything I know. And he could tell you, one thing about him, he could tell you if the hog was cooking or was burning just by smelling. I mean that s how good he was. He he been doing this and he could he could do some things with a hog, cooking a hog that I haven't even learned yet. He didn't show me that part. [Laughs] RF: Who taught him or where did he learn? Do you know? 00:04:37 00:04:38 DO: Well that was before my time. But it was another guy, a gentleman by the name of James Johnson; them two used to cook hogs together. And like I say, I haven't I haven't had too much knowledge of that, but I can tell you, he can he could work a shovel with around a hog; he could cook a hog. And I mean he just could do it. [Finger Snaps] Just like that; he just had it up there. Basically he could do the whole nine yards, cook the hog and cook the hash. You know, that s that s just doing everything and make the sauce. So and he taught me the same way. RF: What kind of teacher was he? Was he a good teacher? 00:05:17

7 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 7 00:05:20 DO: Yeah; the best. I mean he d put it to you like how it s supposed to be done the right way and, like I say, I can't say enough about him. He was I don t, you know, to me, you know, he always. I used to remember a lot of stories he used to tell me about back in the days, you know, and I used to love to just hang around him and just and that s what, you know I used to stay around him and just listen at him tell the stories about how it was and where he done come from and where we re at now. And I didn't go to college. I graduated from high school. And during those days, kind of like I say, I m the thirteenth child and it was kind of rough, you know. Either you work or, you know, you go to school and my family just didn't have the finances to send me to college. And it wasn t all those all these grants and stuff out there at the time when I came on, so I just basically went to work. RF: What were your first jobs before here? 00:06:23 DO: I didn't work I didn't work any place. 00:06:26 RF: Oh, this was your first job? 00:06:29 DO: Right; but I left here a couple for a while, you know. I went to Broyhill Furniture Company, where the make furniture parts. I left for a while and I didn't like the traveling, you 00:06:31

8 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 8 know, and working at night. That was all right; I had to go from here to Summerville and I didn't like the traveling. I didn't like going on the road; five head of us in one car and saw too many accidents and too many sheets covering people up and I just it wasn t for me. I said well, I can work here and come two and a half miles from back to home, out for lunch, basically ride home. RF: Just so I get all the details, what was what high school did you graduate from? 00:07:14 DO: Roberts High. 00:07:19 RF: And what town was that in? 00:07:19 DO: Holly Hill. 00:07:21 RF: And Mr. Smalls, did he ever call himself a pitmaster? Did he ever use that word? 00:07:23 00:07:29 DO: Yeah; in a sense, but he didn't say it like me or you or I would say it. He was a pitmaster; he still is. I mean he could he could sit right here and tell you how to do it. I mean that s just how good he was. You know, he he told me one thing. He said, Once you get it up here ain't

9 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 9 nobody can take it away from you, you know. It s just like putting on your pants, you know. That s how that s the kind of guy he was. He still is. He s up in age now. He s probably maybe seventy-five or better. I haven't seen him. He moved to he used to live right over there but he moved away and him and his family moved to Orangeburg and I kind of like got out of touch with him. But every now and then I go visit. RF: And did he grow up around here? 00:08:15 00:08:16 DO: Yeah; he grew up right in this this area, you know. Right; he s matter of fact, we used to call it Barbecue on the Farm. See it s the farm, you plant corn and soybeans and whatever and then on the weekend they d cook barbecue. That s how it really got started. RF: And who was there somebody in your family that did barbecue? 00:08:35 DO: No; no. 00:08:37 RF: There was somebody in the larger community? 00:08:41

10 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 10 00:08:43 DO: Well it was they just what happened was the old man, Mr. Sweatman, Harold Sweatman of Sweatman s Bar-B-Que, former owner, him and his family used to always cook hogs on the weekend and they would go camping. And they had a pretty good taste, you know, and everything was tasting all right. And they said well, some somewhere down the line someone told him, said, Why don t you try selling it? That s how it got started. He made the sauce, cooked the hash, and cooked the hog and the old man Chalmon Smalls was right there with him. And they started and like I say, they cooked the hogs and then they came up to Holly Hill and then they started serving it out of the window. And a lot of people got attached to it. 00:09:36 From there to here that s where we re at now with Sweatman s Bar-B-Que. 00:09:40 RF: And I want to know a lot more about Mr. Sweatman. What did people call him? He had a nickname right? DO: He had a nickname. It was Bub Sweatman. 00:09:47 RF: What did you? 00:09:50

11 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 11 00:09:51 DO: Margie [Harold Sweatman s wife] and they they were nice people, real nice. I came out here. I was a little boy. I d say I was sixteen seventeen, right after high school, and they just took me under their wing, you know, and I liked them, you know, they treated me you know, they treated me good and we had some rough times, but hard work don t kill nobody. You know, you just got to work; that s where it come from. They taught me how to work hard. You got to work hard for what you want. I didn't have to worry about it; they taught me a lot of things like, you know, I didn't have to go out here and steal or sell drugs or nothing like that. I had a job. I like RF: What kind of boss was he? 00:10:39 00:10:40 DO: A real nice boss. He was kind, generous; I liked him. Sometimes he d tell me, you know because he used to work with my father. He was a foreman and my father used to work under him. He said all right; my dad s name is Pete Peter. So he d say, Pete done told me now if you don t do right I ll cut your behind, you know, and stuff like that. I d just laugh and shake it off. But he was real nice, him and his wife were real nice. I got to know the whole family, you know, his wife and three daughters, Susan, the oldest one is named Judy and the next one is Susan and the next one is named Patricia. And he had two sons, one who died and he died early and the other named well his name was Harold and the other one s name was Al. Both of them are deceased. Nice people, nice people; real nice people.

12 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 12 00:11:50 RF: So continuing with his story, he he kind of convinced himself to start doing barbecue fullscale. Tell me more about that. You mentioned kind of he had several locations when he was. 00:12:04 DO: Well he had this location and, like I said, they started in Holly Hill and his then after he did that and, like I said, the guy he was working for at the time told him he could have this old house and then that s when he turned this house into a barbecue place. And then his son by the name of Al, because Harold died before he got real really started in here, Al rented a place in Rowesville [?] and he used to cater from here to Rowesville. And him and his son, we used to cook hogs for both of them, both restaurants. 00:12:43 And then after that it just went uphill; I mean it grew. And like I say we used to he used to farm and still farms corn, soybeans, and stuff and then on the weekends we d do barbecue. And we used to try to raise our own hogs. He was a hog farmer, too; tried to raise hogs, but we couldn t grow them fast enough. So we got out of the hog business and we kept farming. That s how he used to yeah; he was a hard worker. If you didn't work, you didn't belong around here because he didn't play. [Laughs] He didn't mean nothing by it. It s just that s how he he came up and that s how, you know, handled it. He was a nice real nice guy. RF: Where was his farm? 00:13:34

13 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 13 00:13:35 DO: Right down the road about I d say a mile, a mile from here so we didn't have far to go. He was always home in the house. RF: And what did he look like? Was he a big guy? 00:13:44 00:13:49 DO: Well he was normal built, nice tone; we had a picture but we ain't got no picture. He wasn t too big a fellow. But he wouldn t put you to do nothing he wouldn t do; just a down home type of guy. He worked hard for what he had, he accomplished; you know, what I mean. He didn't mind working. If you wanted to work he had something you could do. He had a good heart, him and his wife. RF: Tell me more about those kind of really boom years when you were doing thirty up to thirty-five hogs over a weekend. 00:14:24 00:14:31 DO: Those those were the years. I mean we used to see, like where that gas tank at, we used to have cars in the front all the way back here. I mean shew; it just outgrew really. I mean we used to go through like thirty like I say thirty-five hogs a weekend. We d cook Thursday night like we re doing now, Thursday night for Friday and Friday night for Saturday and it was it was a packed house here every weekend. We had everybody from all over, from you couldn t

14 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 14 go nowhere and nobody ain't heard about Sweatman s Bar-B-Que. That s I mean they had they just had a real good business. We had a real good business. 00:15:10 I mean just the business now ain't too bad. But it s just the economy, you know. I can't I can't give account for that, so. Maybe went it picks up RF: And so when did Mr. Sweatman pass away? 00:15:23 00:15:26 DO: Oh, let s see. Let s see, seven years ago maybe eight. It s probably been about eight years now. RF: Did he or his wife pass away first? 00:15:39 00:15:40 DO: He passed away. Let me see; I d have she passed away first. He had a stroke. I ll never forget the day when he came out of the hospital. He he wasn t that type of guy, you know, to just sit around. He didn't like that. He didn't want that. He said if he ever get where somebody have to take care of him he didn't like that situation. He never liked that situation. He always wanted to do for others and try to, you know, do his own thing. And his wife, God bless her soul, you know, she was when he got down and couldn t move around like he wanted, but it took a toll on him and she was trying to take care of him and she was they were up in age. You know,

15 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 15 I think it took a toll on her. And he was just laying there, you know, like battling it out, you know. That s what done him, but it got to her first because she had the challenge of taking care of him. 00:16:50 They had kids but, you know, they were in and out and she was there all the time right with him and I think that s what happened. You know, God had another purpose for them. RF: And who who took over? What happened to the business? 00:17:06 00:17:09 DO: They died and the daughters took over. You know, they basically ran it the same way. They like I say that was before that well the son died. The son died before they died, the one named Al. And that was the last. And after they died the daughters took over and they ran the business the same way. I say I m not sure; I think this, you know, new thing just came into play and they was still sticking with the old recipe, you know, the same situation. And I just think, you know, if we d done it a little different because, you know, with this economy, you know. I blame a lot of it on the economy. We should have been shooting a little bit for the stars instead of staying put, you know, but I m not sure. I suspect it, but a lot of it I know a lot of it got to do with the economy. 00:18:16 See, when the old man was running it he had all kinds of things going on. I mean he he had other things, the farm coming in and he used to raise hogs, like I say, and, you know, the

16 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 16 girls the daughters got it and they only had just just, you know so it s a little too much for them, I think, you know. RF: So they recent just recently sold the businesses? 00:18:38 00:18:41 DO: I d say it s been it s a year. And they tried to hold on as long as they could but. And this economy especially when this economy went bad I think they just had to give it up. RF: And has the new owner, Mr. Mark Behr has he kept things the same? 00:19:00 00:19:04 DO: Oh yeah; he s everything is the same. I mean like I say it s he s been telling us as a worker, as an employee, he was telling me, you know, to hang in there with him, you know, and maybe this economy will turn around and hopefully we ll get back to those glory days that I was talking about. You know, so, but I ll give him the benefit of the doubt, going to do that and try to get back. It s it s, like I say it s slowly picking up, you know. But, like I say, the economy is down and a lot of people ain't working and ain't nobody got no money to buy no food. But everybody going to eat barbecue; oh yeah, especially if it s good what we got, they re going to eat what we got, they ll be back.

17 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 17 00:19:48 RF: So let s talk about that barbecue. We ve watched what you ve done in the past two hours. What why is the barbecue so good here? 00:19:54 DO: Well for one thing the way we cook it, the way we prepare it, you know, and our sauce has got a lot to do with it. That s that s basically what it is: how you prepare it, how you cook it. There are a lot of other places, they only do hams and and they some of them cook with gas. We do this with wood since we started and we re still sticking with it. And it s got a lot to do with the sauce. And it s how you prepare the food that means a lot. 00:20:27 My Mama always told me if you put something in it you ll get something out of it. And we start on Tuesdays getting this thing ready for just the weekend. We got to gather wood, get the stuff ready and everything, clean up and everything, and then on Friday Thursdays and Friday we cook. So we re putting a lot in it; it s a lot of hours, a lot of man hours. That s for everybody even the boss, so. Like I said, like Mr. Sweatman see the sign says Sweat-A- Man, that s it. [Laughs] RF: You mean like you re sweating? It takes a lot 00:21:04 00:21:06 DO: That s right; you got you got to do something. You got to do it. This ain't going to fall in your lap. You got to work hard work in it, too, that s right.

18 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 18 RF: So what do you do on that Tuesday? You the first day of the week? 00:21:16 00:21:19 DO: Well we come in and we start gathering get the wood right, and if we got some rain come in, we ll come inside and clean up, and odds and ends and stuff. Like I say, on Wednesdays and Thursdays we ll make the hash and stuff like that. Start cooking on Thursday night. 00:21:39 RF: So we ve watched you fire the hogs. Can you give us kind of the process of cooking a hog from you do whole hogs here and can you give us the process like kind of times and what happens? 00:22:34 All right; we needed to get readjusted. So the the hogs, tell us about the hogs, how to cook a hog. 00:22:40 DO: Basically we got the hogs goes in a locker plant. They got to be inspected. They got to have that USDA stamp on them before we even put them on the pit. The government, they going to check them out and see whether they re sick or anything or if something is wrong with them. If they got that stamp on them we can come we we get the delivered here and we can put them on that pit. If they don t have the stamp we can't put them on the pit.

19 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 19 RF: Does that happen? Do you get them without the stamps sometimes? 00:23:03 00:23:04 DO: No, never, never, never; got to have a stamp, because the inspection man if he catches us with one on there without that stamp he ll shut us down. Anyhow, when they bring them here on Thursday we they re already cleaned and processed ready to go. All we got to do is clean them up a little and take the feet off of them and stuff and then we put them on the pit. And then we light the fire. We ll light the fire and the coals will burn and when the wood burns down we ll get the coals under it and we ll start firing them up as you ve seen us did already. 00:23:42 Then after that we ll cook them probably half the way through and then so much on that side and then we ll turn them over and cook them on the other side. Then in the morning, when we get through cooking them, they ll take them in there and cut them up and put them in a pan. RF: A few detailed questions. When you process then and cut off the feet do you split them down the middle or do they stay whole? 00:24:04 00:24:08 DO: They come split down the middle already. All we do when they get here is take the ribs out. We take the ribs out of them because we cook those separately. If we cook the ribs in the hog we gonn have any bone to take the ribs off. Then we put them on the pit, do our thing.

20 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 20 RF: And what kind of tell me more about the wood? What kind of wood do you use? 00:24:27 00:24:31 DO: Basically we use mostly hardwood; mostly we want to use oak or hickory. We have used pecan but we like oak, live oak, or hickory. That s got the flavor. So as I say, it s straight from nature and no chemicals or nothing. It s what we call creative cooking. RF: Crib cooking? 00:24:52 DO: Creative creative. 00:24:53 RF: Oh, creative? 00:24:54 DO: Right. 00:24:57 RF: Say more about that; what does that mean? What do you mean by that? 00:24:57

21 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 21 00:24:59 DO: It means it s straight. You ain't got nothing, no no gimmicks and no no chemical or nothing. You burn the wood. God growed the trees. You cut the tree down and you you burn the wood and get your coals from the wood. We don t put no nothing on it, nothing with a chemical. It s straight straight from God, you know. RF: Have you had gas-cooked barbecue and what do you think about it? 00:25:24 00:25:28 DO: I ve tasted it, you know. It s just so it s a different taste, a different flavor altogether. I mean I ve tried it. But this is the only way you cook barbecue. You could do that at home. Just make you a little pile, get you some coals and put it up on each grill and cook your steak or whatever, chicken or whatever you want to do. I guarantee you it ll be different different taste. RF: And you were telling me earlier about the wood and how green wood matters and wet wood. Tell me about that. 00:25:56 00:26:03 DO: The only difference there is green wood, you know, it ll last; it won't burn as fast. Like normally, you know, like you burn wood in your they ll tell you now if you burn wood in the fireplace let it dry about a year and then burn it. It ll burn it better. But when you re cooking with barbecue you want green wood. But you can use dry wood it doesn t matter; just the only

22 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 22 difference is one burns slower than the other and the other one burns faster, you know. The dry wood burns fast. That s the difference. You ll get the same coal but it will just be faster. RF: And is there a certain way you scatter the coals? 00:26:41 DO: Well, yeah. 00:26:43 RF: What process do you like? 00:26:46 00:26:48 DO: Well, the way we fire we just we basically put the coals propped in the back and not all over the place, you don t want to do that. Problem is you could get a fire have a fire, you know. When that drip grease drips that grease dripping on that coal, you don t want that hot coals it can start a fire. RF: What s the biggest fire you ve seen or experienced? 00:27:14 00:27:16 DO: It burned this place down. Well I wasn t here but that s what I was told, you know. I haven't we haven't had any fires since then, you know on my shift.

23 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 23 00:27:31 RF: And so what times do you put the what time do you put the hog on and how long does it cook? 00:27:36 DO: We ll start them like 3:30 four o'clock and we ll like I say, we ll cook them until about 12:00 or 1:00 and we ll flip them over and we cook them probably another two and a half to three hours until about four o'clock and then they re ready to be served. RF: And do you spice them when they go on the grill? 00:27:55 00:27:58 DO: No; we ll baste them down when we turn them over with a mustard-based sauce and then after we finish cooking them we ll sit them in a room where they will they will debone them and take all the fat away and stuff and they ll put another sauce on them, the same kind on them before they put in the pan and warm it back up to be served. RF: And do they chop it, do they pull it? 00:28:28 DO: They chop it. They cut it. 00:28:31

24 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 24 00:28:33 RF: And at what point do you go home? 00:28:35 DO: Oh, I ll leave here probably six o'clock in the morning. But I could leave after I get them done but I ll just hang around, you know, until someone gets here. Then I ll go home. RF: So earlier you were telling me before when the sun was setting you were saying how much you kind of love being here at this time. What tell me more about that. 00:28:47 00:28:56 DO: Well that s this is a whole lot quieter, you know peace and quiet. You don t have any have too much going on. That s what see, like now; see it s nice and cool. It ain't too hot. See, you can cook barbecue now. I mean, when it s summer in the summertime like when it gets real hot you sit here and it s nice and cool and peace and quiet. An occasional car will pass by the road, you know, kind of like get next to yourself and make you think a lot, think about the past and the future whatever, you know, because you got to keep your head on straight, you know. You know, you got a job to do and just keep on doing it. Time will go by. RF: How do you make time pass out here? 00:29:43

25 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 25 00:29:44 DO: Oh, sometimes we ll go around there and look at the little TV or turn the radio on, drink a little bit of water or some tea, keep busy, you know. Keep keep your work going and time will go right on by. Soon as it gets dark it s going to get day, so. That s how you do it. 00:30:07 RF: You know, I ve been visiting a lot of whole hog places, but there s only a few left and everyone talks about how they re used to be more. Were there more whole hog, real wood places, in the past? 00:30:24 DO: In this area I don t think there were too many. I mean this this area, I can say out of the whole Orangeburg County, you know, I can say I mean, you got a lot other places that claims they cooking barbecue, I mean, like a lot of our competitors like Duke s and whatnot but it s just not the same. A lot of places are trying to imitate what we doing here. This is the only place you can get good barbecue at, right here, Sweatman s, because we do it the only way, the right way. RF: What does barbecue mean true barbecue; like why is it important to people? 00:31:02 00:31:10 DO: Well it s just like you re putting something on your grill in your yard, you know. The only thing different here is you don t want to do it, we ll be glad to do it. [Laughs] And like I say,

26 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 26 barbecue it just it s just like you re going camping and everybody want to, you know, to put a piece of meat on the fire, you know, and cook it. When it s done you eat it. That s just that s it; I don t know, just to me that s what they call barbecue I reckon. 00:31:47 RF: For the past ten years with Mr. Sweatman passing away and then the daughters taking over and, you know, maybe not, you know, wanting to run it the same way, what have you ever thought that Sweatman s might close? Did it ever cross your mind? 00:32:04 DO: No; never, never, never did never in my wildest dreams because the way I see it, like I say, it s if you don t want to cook, we ll be glad to cook for you. But I all the businesses, any kind of car business or anything you re doing, you know whatever out there, somebody is going to want to eat, right. So I think this business, you know, it s just like any other restaurant. I mean, if you got good food it ll stay open. People are going to come, you know. It ain't like a car lot or anyplace you re going to go buy stuff, you know. Barbecue, I mean like I say, just cooking in general, like when it get real hot, I know sometimes you your wife says, Oh, let s eat out tonight. Where you gonna go? You re going to go someplace where it s got good food. We re right here, Sweatman s Bar-B-Que, waiting on you; come on down. RF: So do you think it will Sweatman s will be here for a long time, forever? What do you think the future is? 00:33:05

27 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 27 00:33:13 DO: Well the future of barbecue here, I think it ll it ll survive. Because like I said, it s back to good food and everybody loves a little pork every now and then especially the skins and ribs, shoot; that s what, you know. I think it ll survive. I m at least I m hoping for the time being. I m pretty sure we ll we ll survive. 00:33:37 RF: And if it disappears, you know, and of course we don t want it to, what happens? What does that mean for the community and for American culture? 00:33:48 DO: Well if it I don t believe it ll ever disappear but I believe someone else will be trying to do it, but if Sweatman s was to go, I mean, it would be a great a great loss to the community. I mean, especially for the employees; it s a job and, like I say, you know, this kind of cooking has been around for a long, long time. And I d hate to see it go because I you know, you won't be getting it like it s supposed to be. You ll be getting like that TV dinners and stuff you can throw in the microwave. You don t want that; you want fresh, you want stuff cooked and served. That s the way I look at it. 00:34:42 RF: And what do you call yourself? Do you call yourself a cook, a pitmaster; do you use a name or a title?

28 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 28 00:34:49 DO: Just a cook that s it, just a cook trying to do the right thing, trying to cook something good. And when I see a lot of people come to eat that s what fuels me, you know. I don t seen a bunch I seen a lot of people come up through here. RF: Do you eat the barbecue here and how do you eat it? 00:35:10 00:35:12 DO: Oh, I nibble, I don t eat much of it. I ve been doing it so long, and you got to watch your arteries, you know. But I have to eat it occasionally. My best parts is the skin, skin and the ribs. And I had a rib sandwich. You ever had a rib sandwich? RF: The bone still in it? 00:35:32 DO: Yeah; yeah, yeah, yeah you got to do that and that bread oh yeah. 00:35:34 00:35:43 RF: So maybe one or two last questions. Would you encourage a young man to do what you do? I mean it s we ve talked about how hard it is and how Sweatman s actually means sweat work.

29 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 29 00:35:52 DO: I m going to put it to you like this. This day and time with the economy like how we got going now, a job is a job. Just like the man got to haul the trash, you got to have somebody to cook. I mean, if you like what you re doing you will do well. If you don t like it you do something else. That s basically it; yeah. It s it s pay and a paycheck. I got a job. Hey different strokes for different folks. 00:36:35 But with me if I had to do it all over again I d I d like to be doing it for myself. But I m not saying it s nothing wrong with working for someone else. I wouldn t mind having a barbecue restaurant because, you know, you could make it work. You just got to do what you know best, you know. And like I say, with TV dinners ain't kicking it they ain't for me. See here you get the whole thing. You get rice, you get slaw, you get hash, you get your meat, you know, you got a whole meal. You can't go to Hardee s or McDonald s and get all that, you know. They ll charge you an arm and a leg for it. Here you got a decent price, eat what you want and you got a belly full when you leave out of there. RF: Do you remember how long it took you to feel like you knew how to cook a hog? 00:37:32 DO: Well I was doing it one night he said, All right, the old man Chalmon, he said All 00:37:39 right, you can either swim or drown. [Laughs] And he turned me loose and I done it and took it

30 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 30 took it from there. He he said, All right, I m going to see what if you was listening to what I was telling you. And I done it and I must have passed. [Laughs] RF: Did he leave that night or did he stay and just watch? 00:38:04 00:38:08 DO: No, he just watched. As I said he didn't you know, he was there in case something went wrong. But I done it; I done it all right. Everything went from there. RF: And did he say anything after? 00:38:21 DO: Job well done. He said, You got it. He said, Now I can go to sleep and you stay awake. [Laughs] 00:38:23 RF: Were you nervous that night? 00:38:34 DO: Oh no; I knew I had it. I just had to prove myself to him that s all. 00:38:36

31 Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que 31 00:38:45 RF: Well, I think we have to fire some hogs. 00:38:45 DO: Yeah. 00:38:47 RF: Okay; well I want to thank you very much. This was this was amazing. 00:38:51 DO: You re welcome. 00:38:51 RF: Thank you, sir. 00:38:56 [End Douglas Oliver Sweatman s Bar-B-Que]

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